or anyone that has an answer.

Dan,

How much did you weigh before you began CKD? Also, what was your percentage of body fat? I read your success story and it does not seem clear exactly what your stats were when you began.

I am currently mere hours away from completing my 2 week induction on Atkins. At about day 9 of induction my workouts began to suffer dramatically. I just felt drained any my muscles felt tired. I have since toned them down until I could figure out a way to shake the sluggishnss.

Upon doing research in the forums I read about CKD and then I read CKD 101 and various other threads. IMHO, it seems as though CKD would primarily benefit those that do not have a significant amount of weight to lose.

I have yet to weigh myself again. But my initial weigh in 7 days into induction showed a 10lb loss. I know that was some water weight and that I will not maintain that rate of loss. However, I would like to lose as much fat as soon as possible keeping in mind that I am building and toning muscle while I am losing fat

I am not a new to working out. In fact, I put some of my 'thin' friends to shame when it come to physical and aerobic feats. But I have concerns that CKD will slow my progress. I would love to be shirtless by June.

Do you have any thoughts on this subject?

Thanks,

gammite

Hey, u will defenitely lose fat with CKD. U will lose more fat on strait Atkins probably since u are not carbing up every 6-9 days (depending on u). However, one thing that u already noticed urself is that u got weak on Atkins after 9 days. See, when ur body can't lift heavy weight, it has no need for muscle mass u have accumulated so it will get rid of your precious muscle!! So enter CKD, carbing up helps u lift heavy weight in GYM so ur body will be hang on to muscle, while the ketosis phase burns fat. So would reccoment continuing with CKD.

The tricky part is everyone is different, and there are a lot of factors that u have to perfect. For me, it took me months (still jsut getting it) to perfect what I need for my carb-up so I can feel good when I come off, but not have gained a grip of extra fat (or any) while doing it.

Also, during the ketosis phase took me a lot to learn what to eat and how much, I think I was not getting enough protein for my frist few months on it. Either way ull see but read these archives in this forumn and ull be OK.

-L8

So, why not try TKD then?
I'm doing a combined TKD/CKD. I eat minimal amounts of extra carbs around the workout (just 25 g but men may need more, a woman doesn't use as much glycogen as a man)
and then carb up in the weekends, also not as much as indictted but about half the recommended a mount and Saturday only (my depletion workout is on Saturday).
For very good results, you might try eating more carbs about an hour before the workout (or drink a carby whey shake) and then see your performance soar!
When you work out hard eough, the excess carbs will have disappeared from the system after the workout and you should be back in ketosis a few hours later..

Good luck

Fietser

Gammite,
Looking at your goals I see that you want to lose 65 pounds. In that case, I would say that CKD may not be the best way to go. Look at the pinned post under BFL talking about Tips and Hints to see that it may be better to increase your carbs slightly in order to meet the requirements of your exercises. You can also search around the posts and you will find that induction level carbs might not support heavy exercise. If you seriously look at CKD it is a exercise/diet plan designed to bring someone down in fat content and is generally not a get-stronger, get-bigger, whatever plan. Think of it in its original idea - bodybuilder works out heavy, builds muscle, gains some fat in the process and then has to get into contest shape - he/she goes on CKD to lose the fat but retain as much muscle as possible within a set period.

Now, TKD (or some form of it) might help - add extra carbs around your workouts but then go back to your diet after the workout. But, you still may find that your diet may still have to contain more carbs than induction will allow.

CKD has been doing well for me so far. When i started last fall i needed to lose 80 lbs, so far i am down 25. I think my results would be much much better if i were more strict on the carb loads so i have no one to blame for my slow progress except for myself.

i am pleased with my progress though, i am steadily losing and i am not having any real problems sticking to the diet or exercise portions.

while my total weight loss is 25 pounds i also feel that my total loss is more than that. I havent tracked body fat percentages so i cant be 100% sure that that has happened. What i do know is that the weights i am lifting have increased significantly since beginning.

I am on track now to reach my goal in about 14 months total, which isnt too bad considering i want to lose almost 1/3 of my body weight.


So all in all i would have to say that CKD is a good program for losing lots of weight.

Hello Folks,

Thanks for your replies. I see that we have some mixed opinions here. I think that I am going to try both methods of carbing up and see which one works best for me.

At this point I have 197.1 lbs of lean mass. That is why I put my goal weight at 200lbs. I really do not want to lose any lean mass but I know that I will as I lose fat. In reality though, I actually do not care what I weigh. I simply want to lose fat. I would be comfortable at 220 or 230 if it was all solid.

I absolutely do not want to go through the 7-10 pound cycles that I have read about in the CKD program. However, I do not think that the small carb up amounts in the TKD program will be enough for me to sustain my workouts and kickboxing training. I am probably going to start with the CKD program however I am going to severely limit my carb-up load to complex carbs and really limit my sugar and grain intake.

After fiddling around with fitday.com I saw that in order for me to be where I want to be by June that I have to lose 3.5lbs per week. That is going to be some helluva workin' out and severely watching what I eat.

Once again thanks for your insights. Hopefully TrainerDan can supply some input as well.

gammite

Limiting ur carbs to complex will interfere with supercompensation aspect of the carbo-load and not take advantage of our highened insulin sensitivity either. Thus I would rethink trying to tweak the plan that much. Remember the point of CKD is that ur body will be able to hold up to %150 glycogen in the muscles if done correctly.

K< peace and hair Greeece

cmorera,

I was not going to specifically consume complex carbs on the carb up. I am planning on utilizing a limited amount of sugar and grains.

My main concern is that as read through these forums I see a number of folks that were stalled or gained when they consumed more than moderate amounts of sugar. At this point in my fat loss I would like to be able to maintain at least a 3lb. per week rate of loss without losing the ability to workout vigorously.

For instance today when I worked out I completed:

9 sets squats - 3 at the max weight of 315
9 sets leg presses - 3 at the max weight of 515
9 sets of leg extensions - 3 at max weight of 150
3 sets of leg curls - 150 lbs
90 chest presses with medium weight until muscle failure

1 mile ran on indoor track in 9min17sec
1 mile interval training on indoor track

My kickboxing training is usually 1.5 hours straight of high intensity bag work, kicks, pad work, footwork, and actual ring time. I usually do this about 3 times a week. There have been times when I have completed these workouts everyday.

I actually felt good today. I have been primarily doing aerobic workouts, bag work, shadow boxing and avoiding the weights since I am going to continue on induction until Friday. However, I know that I may be able to complete one more workout like that this week and that will be it.

Cmorera, given all of that, do you think that I will be able to accomplish my fat loss goals and do the CKD program. You sound pretty knowledgable about this so I would appreciate your opinion. As you are probably aware I have a significant amount fat to lose and that is my issue with attempting to do try the CKD program. Unofficially, I am under 260 now, but I am only going to post my weekly weigh-ins.

Thanks for your input.

gammite

For that LOAD of workouts I think you'd be better off with TKD. It was suggested to ingest 5 g of carbs per 2 sets, but while I mostlydo 30-40 sets, I get enough energy from 25 g of carbs.

But women are said to use less glycogen.. I'd say try carbing up with 50 g of carbs for your workouts..

I actually prefer to keep my carbs low throughout the day and only take them extra before/during workouts (NOT after as I want to use the energy & want to be back in ketosis upon finishing the workout or anaerobic cardio session).

Fietser

Gammite,
If you have a workout you are doing now that is working for you again CKD may not be for you. CKD includes workouts and generally looks like weekend carb-up, then either a Monday full-body workout or a Mon/Tues upper/lower body split. You might be able to do some aerobics on Wed/Thurs and then on Friday you do some sort of depletion workout (followed by a boatload of carbs). TKD or some form of modified lowcarb diet should provide you the energy to do your workouts. Because of the limits of the CKD workouts the increase of lean muscle is only a secondary goal and since lean muscle burns more calories theoretically the weight loss should be better (which is why, Big Dog, many lifters use other diets to drop weight and then use CKD to get rid of the final stubborn fat). But, see how you feel with your workouts and tune your carbs as needed.

Metaldude,

Thanks for your input. After more research in the forums I am inclined to agree that CKD is not right for me at this time. I think that I will attempt a TKD program and see how that works for me.

Thanks again,

gammite