Like a lot of people here, I'm trying to eat 10x my current weight in calories, usually unsuccessfully, and I'm wondering just how much this "lack" is sabotaging my weight loss efforts.

I believe the evidence offered on the forum--it makes sense--but on the other hand, I just received an e-mail from Atkins Center support saying that calories should be no more than 1800.

I guess what I want to know is, how many of us are following the 10x guideline successfully (as in losing weight faster).

judy

I always thought hat the point of the diet is that you didn't have to count anything........and it works great that way. I don't know why people preach that as gospel.........I mean does anyone think I would lose weight if I took in 3320 calories per day . I can tell you from all those un-successful "counting" diets I can't

If you're hungry eat, and stop when satisfied......once we all learn to listen to our bodies, it gets simple. I wish I had started doing that years ago instead of living (and mostly dying) through the calculator

Hi guys,

Bear in mind that the suggestion to "eat more" whether 10x or not, is usually given to people who are undereating and wondering why their weight loss has either slowed or stopped.

So, Sharkie, if you tell me your weight loss has stopped and you only eat, say, 1200 cals/day, I'm gonna tell you to pack away some more food.
Otherwise, as you say, eat when hungry, and eat until satisfied.

But I will always mention this issue if folk are drastically undereating, if only because of the knowledge that the weight they lose will definitely come from muscle tissue rather than fat.

You might be amazed to see the number of people who are getting by on 600-800 cals/day!

As for me, I go to Fitday to keep track of carbs - the cals are there as well - and have found that when I keep between 10 and 12x I lose. Under 10 and over 12, I stop.

Rosebud

I had to reduce calories to 10x lean body mass to lose weight as I approached my goal. This is 1600 calories for my 160 lean body mass and 205 pounds total weight.

The body burns energy based on the lean body mass, not the total weight. Body fat does not burn energy. Extra weight will increase one's expenditure of energy to carry it around but this is probably offset by reduced exercise. Therefore, the amount of calories eaten should be based on the lean body mass and not on the total weight.

Try this approach to break plateaus.

Kent

No, people get beseiged with this "advice" no matter WHAT they are asking about, it's like a roving band of calorie counters raiding the countryside

I think Kent is MUCH closer to the truth when discussing intake versus lean tissue.......why allocate calories for fat

But again, the mantra of the whole diet is based on NOT counting calories.

Thanks for the input, guys,

All of you have very valid points--pro and con--about 10x. I gotta admit, I've been struggling with the concept for the past 5 weeks. Not because my weight loss had stopped or slowed down--I'd lost 16 lbs the first 3 weeks and felt pretty good about it.

Then I started recording at Fitday and--big surprise--learned my calories were usually under 1200 daily. At first, I thought "This is great, I'm eating the kind of food I love, I'm never hungry, and luckily I don't even crave carbs."

Then someone here told me that I was going to mess up my metabolism if I didn't start eating more. So I did--and I've
lost 2 lbs in 5 weeks. That's what I call a slow down.

As I understand it, if my body gets used to only 1200 calories, that'll be my llimit if I want to keep the weight off. Maybe at my age (60) that's all the calories I need, and since I'm not hungry at that level, what's the problem? I haven't "dieted" for 10 years or more, so I think my metabolism is ok--except maybe for the usual age-related resistance.

I think for the next few weeks or so, I'm going to keep recording at Fitday, keep my carbs low, but forget about calories and just listen to my body. I've gotten past the fear of eating fat, so that psychological problem is gone.

Thanks again for your help.

judy

Hi Jude,

You were doing great at 1200 calories and should return to that program. Eating extra calories never worked for me. In fact, I started to gain weight that way. Perhaps it works for younger individuals. I am 63.

You list your goal weight as 145 pounds. If we assume 25% body fat, your lean body mass would be:

LBM = (1.0 - 0.25) x 145 = 109 pounds

Calories = 109 x 10 cal/lb = 1090 calories

However, smaller people should eat more than 10x their lean body mass because their energy loss from heat is greater per pound than for larger people, like me.

So, your 1200 calories would be about 11x your future lean body mass. Your present LBM is probably not much greater because one tends to lose LBM in the absence of carrying around the extra bulk. The only was to increase LBM is by body building methods and that doesn't work very well for people our age.

Keep up the good work.

Kent

Thanks so much for your reply, Kent. I'm going to follow your advice. I think the most frustrating thing has been the "not knowing". I love this WOE and I feel very confident (for the first time) that I can stay with it for the rest of my life.

Do you do any exercising? I know I "should" (hate that word), but....? I have been doing quite a bit of walking lately (at least its a start) because my car is on the fritz. A case of "be careful what you wish for" -- I've been wishing for the incentive to at least go for a walk for several weeks.

judy

I don't usually calorie count anymore, now that I'm pretty much settled into the habits, but I have days where I don't eat enough. The occasional day probably doesn't do any harm, but if I was a newbie trying to get by on 600 calories a day, thinking it was so great that I wasn't hungry, I would *not* be getting proper nutrition. I think it *is* important to keep an eye on calories at least until you're on the right track and making sure that your lack of hunger isn't due to dehydration, for example.

>>If you're hungry eat, and stop when satisfied...

Shark, I agree with you on this, but I think you underestimate how difficult this is for a lot of people. Many people, myself included, have used and abused food to the point where hunger loses its definition. It's tough for a lot of people to dissassociate real physical hunger from non-physical hunger cues like seeing ads on TV, smelling something cooking, etc. Disordered eaters have to learn to seperate hunger from boredom, loneliness, anger, anxiety... while learning, the numbers were pretty much all I had to go on.

....and another benefit of at least trying to do 10x is that it frees us from the old "fat is bad" brainwashing we've endured for years, cause the only way to get close to 10x without the carbs is to eat more fat.

judy

I weighed over 400 lbs, so I know what it is to abuse food and not listen to my body. All the more reason to leave the counting alone, look what is happening to me.........buffet owners would cringe when I entered their place (and have been told to leave more than once).......there was only one speed, completely miserably stuffed. If I didn't have a great deal of muscle mass and fairly active....I'm sure I would have exceeded 6 bills

Actually, Jude, I didn't answer your poll because there wasn't an "I don't bother" answer.

When I started low-carbing, I didn't know how to tell when I was full, but I didn't count calories then and I don't now. Dr. Schwarzbein never mentioned limiting calories up or down, so I just tried to learn to tell when I was full. I think I have because my portion sizes have gone to about half or even less of what they were when I was high-carbing. I have occassionally checked and I tend to eat between 2000 and 3000 calories a day. Sometimes less.

I do believe that we shouldn't have to count calories. But sometimes, if we haven't learned yet to read our own responses to food, we need that guide.

Now to my suggestion to "read the book" . I am currently reading The Protein Power Lifeplan, in fact I've only just reached chapter 4. And I'm not planning to switch to that plan instead of TSP. I've been on TSP for 8 months now, and it's still working for me.

Now to the book: Chapter 2 talks about insulin resistance, reversing it, and controlling calories. They do recommend controlling calories. And they give a good argument for it.

They also talk about how low-carbing will reverse insulin resistance and that when you reach your goal and have a more normal insulin response, you will be able to eat more calories/carbs than you could when you started. This was the part I was most interested in since one day I will reach my goal, and I'm curious about how I will modify my eating at that time -- probably not much .

The most interesting part, however, was a case study of a woman who followed their weight-reduction plan of not eating more than 30 grams of carbs a day, but ate over 5000 calories a day. She didn't lose weight. But the encouraging part was that she also didn't gain weight, which on a high-carb diet she most certainly would have done.

One more reason to read as much as we can. At least as much as I can. I'm on a journey now to read all of the major low-carb books.

;-Deb

Hi Deb,

You're right--I should have included "Don't Bother" as a choice.
In fact, I'm going to try that method myself for now.

I don't have a problem eating more when I'm hungry, but the 10x thing was driving me crazy when I wasn't hungry. It was becoming an obsession like the old days of low-fat, low-calories, but in reverse.

That case study you mentioned, about the woman eating 5000 calories a day without gaining, is really interesting. Actually, as a relative newbie (2 months), it's mind boggling. I still get the feeling sometimes that I've lucked into this secret group, while all the low fat dieters are still suffering. Poor souls.

judy

In the past, I maintained at about 145 pounds for five years on weight watchers. Maintaining was good....it was the 1000-1200 calories a day limit that was not so good.

LC has been a huge improvement for me and I've been eating about 1700-1900 calories a day since about 200 pounds and have continued to lose quite nicely.

I feel no need to drop calories and hopefully lose quicker since I'm in no huge rush to get to goal now. This is how I'm going to eat for the rest of my life anyway. The good news is that I can eat as much as I do and still lose weight, so I'm happy with food selection and quantities, and satiated with the diet.

My concern with dropping calorie intakes during the weight loss portion of LCing is that less calories taken in then will mean that even fewer calories will be needed to maintain weight. My personal goal is to be able to maintain my new healthy weight at the highest quantity of calories possible so that I can continue to enjoy food and reach satiation.

JMHO
Marlaine