The idea that fat people have sometimes a distorted vision of reality and can´t stop eating the wrong things, eat for emotional relief etc. etc. fuel the idea that it is an addiction like any other.

So are/were we fat people really junkies?

Some are, some aren't.

The addiction connection hasn't really been proved, as far as I nnow, with food. While there is an insulin response, I think the body can be "retrained" to respond normally to foods that once made us go nuts. This isn't something that can be done with other addictions. Just ask a recovering alcoholic.

Many of us got fat in a variety of ways and for a variety of reasons: eating high carb (pyramid) because that's what we thought were were supposed to do; bad habit; emotional eating; medical conditions.

It's not a one-size-fits all situation. Food is a complex issue because it's something we HAVE to do to survive. It's not like we can just abstain as one can from tobacco or alcohol.

i was definitely a junky when i was fat. I had the absolute worst eating habits ever.

I reckon lots of folk will disagree with me, but I think the word "addiction" has suffered from overuse during our generation. What about a plain-old bad habit that's hard to break (aren't all bad habits?!) and easier to keep going back to over and over?

Some may be, I don't think I am.

I wasn't fat as a kid or even an adult. I got bigger and bigger as I aged and my metabolism slowed down, plus I had back surgery and then fell and broke my shoulder. So, I'm not saying I wouldn't be overweight if those two things hadn't happned, but I wouldn't be this overweight (I don't think).

I think for me, the best thing someone (I don't know who) could have done was pound it into my head that you have got to decrease your eating as you get older. I've known women who did amateur athletic competitions and trained consistently but still put on weight as they got older.

You also have to understand the processed carb problem and the overweight issues. Once overweight, leptin does not do what it is supposed to do. I guess when you think on it, it starts from the time we are babies and given that cereal stuff out of a box. And for some, that starts the ball rolling and for them, I don't think it is a psychological addiction.

I agree that the word addiction has been overused, however, I feel that when we reduce our carbs, we experience withdrawal. So how can you experience withdrawal without being addicted? Hmmm, such ponderings.

Citruskiss, in truth a rather strong case could be made for sugar (not food in general) as an addictive substance using the criteria that I posted above:
Tolerance, withdrawal and loss of control. I'll also add in that sugar (and high levels of carbs which become sugar) produces certain changes in brain neurotransmitters (increased seratonin production) and the changes produced are similar to those produced by other addictive drugs. Sugar does produce a calming/mood elevating effect temporarily, but it's a two-edged sword. While sugar increases seratonin production, at the same time it reduces the body's ability to produce the building blocks of seratonin so over a period of time, seratonin production actually drops off.
Even more interesting is the fact that the high blood sugar/low blood sugar cycle produced by a high carb/sugar diet can be a trigger for cravings in someone addicted to a chemical substance (alcohol, for one) and at least one person (I can't remember his name off hand...he's from Alaska) has had remarkable success with alcohol addiction recovery by combining a low carb regimen with addiction recovery. Since my DH works in the addiction recovery field, he's very interested in this connection and we've discussed this several times.
So....food in general as an addictive substance, not likely; most foods simply don't fit the criteria for an addictive substance. Sugar (and high glycemic carbs) as an addictive substance; possibly.
That being said, there are other aspects to addiction besides the substance itself because not everyone who consumes some addictive substances becomes addicted. Alcohol is one example; not everyone who consumes alcohol becomes addicted to it. I believe sugar is similar in that respect.

This is very interesting, I had no idea that sugar could effect serotonin production in that way. Furthermore, I must admit that I'm not surprised that eating a high-carb/high sugar diet and the resulting sugar highs and lows would have an effect on someone struggling with an addiction issue. I mean, I've noticed that I'm much more comfortable eating low-carb food than I was back in the days of high carb.

I'm not addicted to anything (well...I lied, because I love coffee and I smoke cigarettes), and yet, I notice a distinct change in my overall comfort. And it took trying a low carb diet (eating plan or whatever you want to call it) to discover this. When I ate a high carb/high sugar diet, I wasn't all that aware of the effects on my body. It's only since I've been low-carbing that I'm seeing a difference in the way I feel. I feel much, much better overall. More energy, less frazzled and so on. I'm not drinking as much coffee and I find that I smoke fewer cigarettes. Interesting eh?

Funny thing is - my Dad is in AA, and has been for years. He stopped drinking more than 30 years ago. This being said, he's "addicted" ...or should I say.."rather attached" to his Vick's cough drops and his sugary iced tea. Is this a common phenomenon among alchoholics who stop drinking? I mean, is this something that you and your husband have noticed in your work/research into food and addictions in general? Just curious. I could just ask my Dad if any of his fellow "program people" eat cough drops or drink a lot of soda or what have you.

Anyway, thanks for the response - I find your insight and experience quite intriguing.

Personally, I feel we are all "overeaters" by nature. In other words, I don't think having a "heavy" appetite is abnormal.

We're supposed to constantly seek out food, because in the grand scheme of things, over 2.5 million years of evolution, food has been hard to get, and hard for our bodies to process as compared to the ultra-refined foods of today.

I think where it becomes an eating disorder is when we follow our natural biological urge to find/consumer food but unfortunately we do it with the types of foods that are available today, so as we grow into adulthood we start looking "heavy". We go on our first diet, denying ourselves what our bodies want, and it's all downhill from there. Food becomes a primary focus because we're never sure when we will get more of it.

Therefore, I wouldn't classify it as an addiction per se. Especially once we've dieted--even one time--our bodies ultra-crave very refined foods because our bodies wonder when the next food will come from...so they demand foods that can be stored right away, "just in case".

And round and round it goes...and gets worse and worse year-on-year. It's pretty unfair, really. But anyone who thinks he/she is an "addict" or "lazy" or a "glutton" or a "heavy eater" should realize that she is none of those things. Rather, she's a homo sapiens sapiens. Period.

Overeating is a habit, not an addiction. I was addicted to some of the asthma meds my doctor was over medicating me with. I went cold turkey on them and thought I was going to die! It was the absolute worst thing I had ever gone through! Another result of those meds was the weight I had gained while taking those meds for two years! They gave me a horrendous appetite! Once my system got through the withdrawal process I still ate the same. Why? I firmly believe it was because I had formed the HABIT of overeating and didn't address that habit at that time. I also had withdrawal symptons from giving up sugars and flours. Can those symptoms be compared to the ones I had when I went off all those prescription drugs? Absolutely not even close folks! It was a walk in the park compared to prescription drug addiction and going off the stuff! They just cannot be compared and to be honest, it is an insult to folks that have gone through addictions to drugs, whether legal ones or not, as well as alcohol. Of course there is the factor of emotional eating, but I strongly feel we are heading back into the realm of habit there as well! When I would get upset it was my habit to go to Taco Bell then stop off and buy a huge candy bar! Then, if I was still upset I would reach for my all time favorite comfort foods...poptarts and cornbeef hash! Then lets not talk about spam! Would you believe I have a can in my cupboards...been there since August and I have no desire to eat it! Why??? Because I feel I have changed my attitude as well as my habits regarding food. Now I could be wrong, but this is my opinion and I am sticking by it! (I had to state that because lately I have ruffled feathers with my opinions).

I agree that the level of severity of withdrawal symptoms from hard drugs is quite different and more severe than the symptoms of withdrawal from sugar and/or caffeine, which is why hardcore substance abusers need to detox in a medically supervised facility, but that doesn't mean that someone can't be addicted to sugar or caffeine. The severity of withdrawal is more of an indication of the level of addictiveness (and the physiological effects of a specific drug on the body) of the substance than it is of the level of addiction.
Nobody is trying to minimize the seriousness of drug/alcohol addiction or the experiences that those addicted endure to get off those substances, but rather to make a case that sugar fits the critera as an addictive substance as well, even if the severity of withdrawal is less. Why get into a comparison of "my withdrawal was worse than your withdrawal"? Withdrawal symptoms are withdrawal symptoms and indicate an addiction was/is present.
But for comparisons sake, I've gone through both nicotene withdrawal and carb withdrawal and the symptoms were fairly similar in both cases (headache, anxiety, nausea, extreme cravings) and yet the Surgeon General has compared nicotene addiction to heroin addiction as far as the level of addictiveness of both drugs. I wonder if the Surgeon General was trying to insult recovering heroin addicts with that statement?

Absolutely, Citruskiss! What they're doing is essentially scratching the same itch, but with a different (more acceptable) substance. Part of the recovery program that my DH works in focuses on nutrition and healthy eating since many addicts are chronically malnourished. Since he's responsible for meal planning and grocery purchases for the home, he's made a concerted effort to cut back on the amount of 'junk food' purchased (they don't buy pop, period, minimal chips, etc..). If they want sweet treats, they have to make them themselves (and frequently do). As a means of pointing out the connection between sugar and cravings, he had several of the more skeptical clients perform a little experiment after his group discussion on the connection between blood sugar and cravings. One day, they ate a high glycemic breakfast and recorded their responses (emotions, level of hunger, level of cravings, etc...). The next day, they tried a low glycemic breakfast and made the same observations. What do you know? Every one of them noticed a distinct difference between the two (with the low glycemic breakfast distinctly better in all respects). That being said, it doesn't stop them from complaining that he refuses to buy Captain Crunch (or any cereal for that matter but CC seems to be the one requested most often) and Pop Tarts.

Don't kid yourselves. Most of us have chosen this way of eating because it eliminates foods with phsychologically and physiologically addictive properties. The amount of people who cannot touch 1 of the forbidden foods with out going on a binge lasting hours or days *raises hand*. Heavily obese people claiming their "large appetites" are responsible while they compusively and morbidly stuff mouthful after mouthful of starch and sugar into their mouths (guilty). Eating high-carb "comfort foods" to relieve depression and comfort phsycological unrest (guilty). The thumping headaches that are most common in the 1st couple of days of lo-carbing (I get them). I am no scientist, but these things indicate there's more to grandma's apple pie than meets the eye.

The 30 pounds is only part of the reason I hopping back on the lo-carb bandwagon. I want the positivity, cheerful disposition and energy back. I'm sick of the high and lows, the feeling of being drugged, the anxiety and the inability to sleep properly because of the so-called "food" I am eating now. I'll go out and drink much beer and eat much starch tonight, wake up tomorrow feeling almost suicidal and then cook myself some bacon and eggs and start my long road to recovery.

I imagine a medication is a stronger addiction than some others. I know it was hader physically for my husband to give up cigerettes than coffee, but coffee was still an addiction. He had physical symptoms etc. When I first stoped eating sugar I was sick! Headache, fluelike feelings that lasted about 3 days. The cravings were pretty intense. I wondered the house lokking for something that would help. Luckily I'd cleared the house! LOL

I think "addiction" is overused as well. It seems to be used to cover those bad habits, like mammac-5 said, while I believe a TRUE addiction falls WAY on the more severe end of the spectrum.

I look at it like the difference between being a heavy drinker and a true alcoholic. I know MANY people who used to have a real problem drinking (myself included) who have been able to moderate their drinking and change their perspective. I used to drink to get DRUNK. Now, I have an occasional drink because I like the taste, and can LEAVE it at ONE drink.

IMO, a true alcoholic is someone who just can never do that.

I'm not saying there aren't real food addicts out there, I just feel most of us fall more in the "heavy eater" category, no pun intended. Either eating the wrong foods for our bodies, or just too darn much out of habit or emotion... but it would be a rare person, again, IMO, who can't learn to moderate their eating and regain health. When I think of "food addict", I think of the people who eat to the point of becoming housebound, drowning in their own bulk when ALL reason is gone. Literally eating themselves to death. Now to be driven to eat when you can no longer get out of bed....to me, THAT is a true addiction.

Just my 2 cents.