I'm currently doing Atkins and a modified version of Body For Life but am not getting the results I'd like. I know I've gained muscle, but I can't get rid of the layer of fat that's preventing it from being visable. Naturally since following Atkins, I'm scared to death of the carb-ups. I have a few more questions before actually trying it:

I know most of you don't recommend Hydroxycut for a thermogenic and that's fine with me considering my budget. What thermogenics do you recommend that are reasonably priced?

How many carbs do you generally eat during the week, (not the carb-ups)?

Since I'm trying to lose fat, should I be doing cardio? If so, how much, how intense? I know some of you only lift.

Last week I briefly fell off the wagon and had breaded meat and had stomach cramps the rest of the night. Does this happen during the carb-ups?

Do you think a CKD is right for me since Atkins is just helping me maintain and low-fat made me gain 35 pounds in 3 months?

Thanks in advance, I really appreciate it!!

Try Ripped Fuel - these days you can get it relatively cheap - $16 for a 120-count jar. Throw in aspirin from the neighborhood drug store and you got pretty much real ECA stack.



0. That's me though - I'm capable of eating tuna and mayonnaise every friggin' day.



Yes. How much and how intense - depends on your endurance and conditioning. IMO, very low intensity cardio is simply not worth doing - just eat less and you'll get the same results. Intense cardio and interval training do wonders in terms of glycogen depletion but are extremely hard to do throughout the whole CKD cycle.



I suppose that may happen if you're eating carbs that require digestive enzymes to break down (such as breads, vegetables, etc.), because those enzymes downregulate in abscence of carbs. For best results on CKD, don't mix - if you're eating carbs, follow the rules such as avoiding fructose, keeping the fat to the minimum, etc.



"I don't know. I have no data." --Sherlock Holmes.

Thanks west on 46, for clearing up some of those questions. Sorry, that was a stupid question, how could anyone know if this will work for me? I especially like the answer to the carb question. I could live on chicken and mayonnaise.

I'm not looking for a quick fix, but what's a reasonable amount of time to tell if it's working for or against me? How long does it usually take before you start seeing results?

I am on week 4 - seeing results already!

My words of wisdom would be - beware of the thermogenics. If your stomach is sensitive you may want to try cayenne pepper supplements (there is a 'cool' forumula) or something without ephedra. You might also need to start out on a very low dose and reduce your caffeine intake. I take one Sunday-Thursday, counterproductive to take it during carb ups.

I was reading Lyle McDonald's write up and he mentioned strong carb cravings for the first 3 weeks. Amen to that! This will pass. I kind of felt out of control for a couple of my carb ups (dare I say it...PANCAKES! ). I am getting a hold of myself, now. As West mentioned, the carb up is low fat. Hard to get a handle on that if you've been lc for awhile. (fruit? what's that?)

Check out Trainerdan's words of wisdom on this site, read all you can and keep asking questions.

Good luck!

Also keep in mind that saturated fat reduces insulin sensitivity, i.e., carbs you eat in that state are more likely to go into fat. On straight Atkins it's probably not a big issue since you're not eating any carbs, but on CKD is might be because the carbup is as, if not more, important as the ketogenic phase. This thought shows up in Duchaine's BodyOpus and Lyle's journals. How long this reduced insulin sensitivity lasts - don't know, but I've been avoiding saturated fat altogether and it seemed to have helped. That kind of sucks because it knocks convenient things like cheese off the menu, but... that's how it is, I guess!

I am going to give it a try. My question is what is the best way to get started? I've been working out for 4 years and here is my current program on Atkins:

Sunday: Lower Body Workout (I'm not soft on myself, I still feel it on Wednesday.)
Monday-30 minutes HIIT cardio
Tuesday: Upper Body Workout-(work chest, shoulders, tri's, bi's, and back) 2 exercises per bodypart/3 sets each to failure.
Wednesday:30 minutes HIIT cardio
Thursday: Repeat of Tuesday
Friday: Either 30 minutes of HIIT cardio or 45 minutes of low/medium intensity cardio (depending on energy level)
Saturday:Upper Body Circuit-1 exercise per bodypart/repeat 5 or 6 times

Should I start carb-up this weekend or wait until next weekend? If I start it this weekend, I should start it on a day of weight training not cardio, right?
Is it best to start with a 12 or 24 hour carb-up?
I was thinking of flip-flopping Thursday and Friday this week so Friday is a weight day, then do the carb up for 24 hours and start fresh Sunday with the following workout:

Sunday: 15 minutes cardio, Lower Body
Monday: 15 minutes cardio, Upper Body
Tuesday: Cardio
Wednesday: Cardio
Thursday: Cardio
Friday: Lower and Upper Body circuit, start carb-up
Saturday: off

How does this look, what would you change? Also, how intense should my cardio? Sorry for all the questions, I just want to have a plan in place before I get started.

It's my understanding you need to take two days off from exercising while you carb up. I generally take off Saturday and Sunday. It is also important to push yourself on Monday, get rid of those excess carbs and get yourself into ketosis. Friday should be a toughie, as well.

-Screw that.

I'm with ya homey

I'm not sure we've answered your questions adequately! I re-read your post. If you've been doing Atkins I should think you could go right into the carb up on Friday. Or take another week to gather your facts (I recommend reading some of Lyle McDonald's stuff, also the previous CKD posts).

You do this on Atkins? Daym!

Sounds like quite a program. HIIT is excellent for CKD - combines the best of carb-depleting weight training effects and fat-burning cardio effects. It's also supposed to enhance growth hormone release.

You may want to stop short of failure when doing CKD. Lower intensity and higher volume may be better, especially towards the end of the week.

In "The Ketogenic Diet" Lyle enumerates the total time under tension that you have to put a muscle through to achieve whichever glycogen depletion level you're aiming for. Shame on me - I forgot the numbers and the book is somewhere in storage. 10-15 sets per muscle group per week has been working for me.

Do try a 12-hour carbup, then check whether the next week strength/endurance are the same. That's probably a good gauge of whether you're replenishing glycogen well enough.

Iowagirl-I read all 5 pages of the CKD forum last night. I'm going to look into the Lyle McDonald site tonight. I just want to make sure I fully understand this before I jump in. It's very interesting. I am going to do the carb up Friday after my workout.

West-Thank you, you really cleared up a lot for me. Yes that's what I'm doing for exercise now on Atkins and I can't lose an inch. My energy actually increased on Atkins. I've tried higher calories/lower calories and messed around with the ratios. I haven't eaten sugar or white flour for 4 years before starting Atkins, so maybe it wasn't much of a shock to my system. The carb-up may be the shock I need.

Well I can't eat wheat because it makes me bloated to all hell. I suspect that it's an allergy to gluten but I've never had it tested. Eating 5 pounds of smarties in a weekend apparently doesn't!

-Dude, step away from the smarties. Dare I say, they're not even that good...

I'm making the switch from PP to CKD. I started late yesterday and slept like a baby last night, something I've never done when deep into LC. I've been stalled for about five weeks and the workouts have been getting worse. Plus I've had overwhelming late night carb cravings anyway especially after workouts. I think my body has been tyrying to tell me something.
So - I'm only going to do a 24 hour carb up, as Lyle seems to think that has the most impact.
I'm following Lyle's ratios for my LBM- 800C, 76F, 193C .
I want to start a big carbo burn workout tomorrow, Sunday. Does this seem reasonably ok with all you experts?