Nat,

Most people I help are "normal" people that may exercise 2-3 times / week or not at all. Most of them fall within the 20-30% bodyfat range. About a third of these, or some 40 people, are people who bought the Atkins book. Apart from the initial weight loss (from water due to glycogen and sodium discharge) they showed insignificant fat loss gains.

I am sure you agree that we are all different. As mentioned in the second posting by me in this thread, some people can easier maintain ketosis than others. Some people are very sensitive to glucose and struggle to maintain ketosis. In these cases, my experience shows that unless you monitor your food intake you will not reap the benefits.

You talk about helping. Isn't this to help? The 40 or so people I mentioned earlier would have given up the Atkins diet if it wasn't for my assistance. If you are still doubtful about introducing any kind of rigour into your ketogenic diet if you don't show results, I am more than happy to point them to this forum to share their experiences.

In terms of quoting research, you must be VERY careful. It is true that in most circumstances the body converts protein into fatty acids. The quoted text talks about "carb restriction". What does this mean? The modern diet prescribes that 65-75% of your calories should come from carbs. On a 2000 BMR this is 1300-1500 cals, or 325 - 375 grams of carbs per day. Most doctors would call 1/2 of this amount a carb-restricted diet. On 162.5 grams of carbs ketosis would be unobtainable, as there would be abundant of glucose available. Yes, the quoted text is correct, excess protein in this scenario will largely convert to fatty acids.

But the ketogenic diet is different. Here we have a SHORTAGE of glucose. Very little research exists on this subject (ie. excess protein consumption under ketogenic circumstances) but well respected ketogenic practitioners (like Dan Duchaine to mention one) have observed the conversion of excess protein into glucose under ketosis. My own research, using 12 people in ketosis, indicates that keeping all other factors constant, excess protein increases glucose level (up to a point that if a very excessive amount of protein is consumed the ketosis is interrupted).

I think one point of disagreement between us is what keeps people motivated (and perhaps their are some cultural differences underpinning this). Although I do (wholly) agree that we must get away from the "starvation" mentality of the low-fat diets, I do believe that a ketogenic diet must also show RESULTS. If these results are not forthcoming, people will lose motivation and give up.

I can only interpret your objections to my posts that either you believe that the results are less important, or you believe that everyone that tries the ketogenic diet will automatically get the desired results. My experience points to the opposite.