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Old Mon, Oct-20-03, 02:51
gilibel's Avatar
gilibel gilibel is offline
Phoenixa
Posts: 3,273
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 164/136.6/132 Female 172/5'8
BF:Yes.
Progress: 86%
Location: Sweden
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WHOA!!! Hang on just a minute here...

I think my private little quest for the underlying problem/ reason for my present oedema in some way has contributed to some confusion here. I'm sorry if anything I've written has been taken out of context and used as "truth carved in stone".

Since I have cut down on sodium, drink bucketloads of water etc. I wanted to further search into why my (8 day old) oedema stubbornly stays around my ancle/right foot - and yes, I'm going to see the dear doctor today...

Just as Becky quoted, I first got information from a Swedish LowCarb-list (with people who've been LCing for over a year or more) where someone stated that they had recently discussed protein & oedema, and that they'd come to some kind of conclusion that protein could cause oedema - which I mentioned in a post in Becky's European thread, where I hang quite a bit. Later on though, as I certainly don't rely on one source as "The Truth", I found totally contradicting information at www.vitaviva.com. This I also posted, and Becky has quoted some of the vitaviva info too (the basic explanation to what "oedema" is), although unfortunately omitted the key info, as what they actually write is (my bad translation):

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(In the previous paragraph they speak about oedema caused by too high intake of sodium, caused by a bee sting, bad blood circulation etc)

Protein can be lost through urine - nefrotic(sp?) syndrome - which is a kidney disease causing protein and salt deficiency through kidneys, whereby important nutrients are lost in the blood. Protein binds liquid in the bloodstream. Deficiency of protein causes the liquid in the blood stream to penetrate the surrounding tissue and thereby causing water retention in the legs (limbs). This phenomenon is called osmosis.

(And then the article continues to explain oedema caused by kidney failure, it's effect on sodium/urine, sodium stuck in tissue etc.)

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The bottom line: if protein has anything to do with oedema, it's that LACK of protein - in some special cases - can cause it. Not the other way around. I have posted this info on the Swedish LC-list, but gotten no reaction to it as of yet.

The reason Becky missed this is because the www.vitaviva.com site isn't fully translated into English yet and I have only posted this info in Swedish in my journal. Also, the protein/oedema discussion has mainly been between me and another forum member who happens to be Norweigan. So the info I've posted (yesterday) to her has been quotes in Swedish, which only she can read and understand. I was going to translate it to English, but haven't had time yet. For instance this recommendation on protein intake (since she was worried that hers at 87 grams was too low for the day):
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My (seriously bad) translation from Swedish:

The National Health Board's recommendation is that the diet should consist of 10-15 energy percent protein, for healthy people with low to moderate activity level. For people exercising and thereby straining their body to a greater extent, the amount should be higher. General guide lines are:
Untrained people, approx. 1 gram per kilo body weight
Moderately trained people: approx 1.5-2 grams per kilo body weight
Very trained people: approx 2-3 grams per kilo body weight


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These guidelines suggested that her intake of 87 grams (landing on 1.2g/kg bodyweight) was perfectly within the health recommendations. (Although, protein discussions and guidelines here on this board seem to alter/differ depending on what plan people are on.)

So, I'm truly sorry if I - unintentionally - have mislead anyone due to the language barrier. My appologies to Becky, who I know to be very helpful and a great support to fellow LCers.

/gil

EDIT - New info after doctor's appointment:

Dear Doc said that too much as well as too little protein can cause oedema!! If too much protein is consumed, it can burden the kidneys heavily hence causing leaking/oedema. Just as well as the other explanation about protein deficiency I posted above! Unfortunately he didn't have any figures as to what would be "too much protein". Probably loads more than any of us consume anyway.
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