Xenical & low carb??
 

OK, I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this question, but here goes. In the past, I went to a Dr. who prescribed Xenical for me. I was able to lose some weight while taking it, but of course my high-carb, low-fat diet caused my Type 2 diabetes problems, high cholesterol and high triglycerides to escalate even further, hence I'm now a thoroughly convinced low-carber. Here's the question: Xenical works by blocking about 30% of dietary fat from being digested. It simply passes through. If I take Xenical while doing Atkins, will I still get the benefit of 30% of my dietary fat passing through my system undigested while retaining the LC benefit of those fat calories keeping my metabolism up and hunger at bay? Or does the dietary fat have to be digested, or at least available for digestion? I'm thinking sort of a double-whammy effect here. Yeah, I know, the Xenical causes nasty side effects: "...gas with oily discharge, an increased number of bowel movements, an urgent need to have them, and an inability to control them, particularly after meals containing higher amounts of fat than are recommended." excerpt from www.xenical.com. I had those side effects when I took it before, and I'm willing to live with them for a while if it will get my weight loss moving (I've been on Atkins induction since 9/22 and have only lost 2 or 3 lbs, depending on what the scales say that day). I'm thinking only use it for one, maybe two meals per day so that I don't spend every waking hour on the toilet. :eek:

Anyway, does anyone have any ideas??

Hi MsDad,

I don't believe that Xenical has any place in a low carb diet. We need our fat! ;)
And yes, our fat needs to be digested, so there is no point taking a drug to prevent that.

If you reread DANDR, you'll see where the good doctor says to not even try to do a low fat version of Atkins. And taking Xenical will turn a low carb eating plan into a low fat one.

Xenical is marketed for low fat plans, because so many people misguidedly believe that is the "healthy" way to lose weight. We know better. :)

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

Fat blockers and Atkins are incompatible in my opinion. Atkins works because it is a high fat diet. The more fat consumed, percentage wise, encourages your body to burn fat.

A fat blocker is designed for those poor people that have to follow a low fat diet. The mistaken belief is that fat causes you to be fat with no science to back it up. People who low fat, also have to low calorie. They believe that because we are told that fat has 9 calories therefore to low fat thinkers cut the fat and you cut the calories.

Low carbing is a science unto itself. Low carb levels keeps your insulin production in check. No fat is stored without the hormone insulin.

To lose only a few pounds in a month when you have a great deal to lose may mean that you are doing Atkins incorrectly or that you are metabolically resistant.

You could always post your menu to get it checked out.


Good luck,

Beth

Thanks for the quick replies. Let me clarify my thinking on this. I know that low-carbing requires higher fat intake. But my thought process is that if I can get all the benefits of eating the fat while letting a percentage of it pass undigested, this could speed up weight loss (i.e., the body is "tricked" into thinking those fat calories are at its disposal, but then a good portion of them exit the body before they get a chance to be used as fuel priot to stored fat being burned - but of course if the dietary fat has to be digested for LC to work, it's a moot point). Does this rationale make any sense whatsoever or am I totally deluded (always a possibility!)?

As to food, I've posted a couple of days' typical menus previously and the general concensus has been that I may have need a bit of fine tuning, but that I was on the right track. Another issue though, is that I'm Type 2 diabetic and have been having problems getting my blood glucose levels to stay down consistently (even eating absolutely ZERO carbs for 2 or 3 days!). I see my Dr. tomorrow morning for a regular checkup and will run this by him then, but I think my liver is converting protein to glucose and keeping my BGLs elevated. I just don't know what to do about that one, though.

I really don't think I'm metabolically resistant. I can lose weight on low-fat, low-cal. But the problem is what is does to my diabetes...BGLs through the roof, hypertension, etc, etc. Definitely won't ever go that route again.

Whew, didn't mean to be so wordy....

Yes, the fat does have to be digested to receive the benefit. So removing some of it with the Xenical is simply counterproductive.

Where did you post your menus? Maybe starting a journal would be a good idea, so that some of us could help you out regularly. :)

Do you use Fitday to track your carbs?

Cheers.

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

Yes, I've used Fitday, but I mainly use it to track my carb/protein/fat ratios. My menu was posted in "Introduce Yourself." Here it is again, along with my meds and supplements:
Meds
Metformin
Wellbutrin
Niaspan
Prandin
Diovan HCT
Aspirin (pm)

Supps
Garlic (am)
Flax oil capsule (at least 2 a day, usually 3)
Atkins Essential Oils capsules (2 a day)
Atkins Dieter's Advantage (4 a day)
Atkins Accel (2 a day)
Evening Primrose Oil (2 a day)
Multi-vitamin with herbs (includes chromium piccolinate)

Menu
Breakfast
2 slices ham (about 2 oz ea)
2 scrambled eggs (in SmartBeat margarine - no trans fats!)

Lunch
6-8 oz beef, pork or chicken
3/4 c veggies (either broccoli/cauli or brussels sprouts) with butter or SmartBeat
sugar-free Jello

Snack
Pork rinds, sometimes with a couple oz cream cheese

Dinner
6-8 oz protein (I've been on a meatball kick lately; mix 1 lb ground round with an egg, 1/2 c flaxseed meal and seasonings and fry in 50/50 olive oil/peanut oil--YUM!)
small salad (lettuce only) with olive oil/cider vinegar dressing

Snack
a little cheese OR
an Atkins nut chew bar (occasionally)

Changes since that time:

Breakfast: I've cut down to 1 piece of ham and 1 egg
Lunch: I've reduced the protein to 4-6 oz
Dinner: The meatball kick is over, now it's about 6 oz of chicken, beef or pork
Snacks: the Atkins bars are long gone

Hi again Eddie,

How about posting some typical Fitday stats? :)

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

Oops, forgot I added CLA and fish oil capsules to my supps, 1 each twice a day. Here are Fitday stats from yesterday and today:

10/27
Total calories: 1874
Fat: 154g 1384 cal 74%
Sat: 51 463 25%
Poly: 40 361 19%
Mono: 50 453 24%
Carbs: 23g 53cal 3%
Fiber: 9 0 0%
Protein: 108g 430 cal 23%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%

10/28
Total calories: 2032
Fat: 187g 1685 cal 83%
Sat: 70 630 31%
Poly: 35 311 15%
Mono: 73 658 32%
Carbs: 10g 34 cal 2%
Fiber: 1 0 0%
Protein: 77 307 15%
Alcohol: 1 5 0%

I just realized I never saved any of my Fitday stats before yesterday, but I normally eat just a little more protein at dinner than I have the past two days. And today's carbs were a tad lower than normal as well. I'm usually between 15-18g.

I've also joined a gym, been doing cardio every day for the past week (20-25 min ~ gym 3 days, 10-12 min ~ home 3 days, 1 day off; plus weight training 3 days). This should be fairly typical of my exercise schedule. Also, as BGLs have been erratic, I'm only taking Prandin before meals with carbs and am weaning off the Wellbutrin and Metformin. Will talk to Dr tomorrow about Diovan (BP med). This all hinges of course on my bloodwork and BGLs.

As is becoming the norm for me, this too evolved into another soliloquy...

Hi Eddie,

First up, have you measured yourself? It's highly possible that you have lost a few pounds of fat while gaining muscle. Low carbers often do that, simply because we start to get enough protein after eating too little before.

On the whole, your food looks pretty good. The only suggestion I'd make would be to eat a little more, not less. (Sounds odd I know :daze: )
For example, go from 2 eggs to 3, not 1. ;)

I think your calorie intake needs to be around 2500 cals if not more. You need about that just to maintain your basal metabolic needs, and as you are working out regularly, you can probably eat even more.

Eddie, I can't promise that this will have the desired effect, but I can tell you I have seen many folk here lose more when they increase their calories (and carbs).

All the best, mate.

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

OK, I can try to increase the calories. But I honestly am not hungry on what I've been eating. In fact, I was very surprised to see just how low my caloric intake has been. I found a BMR calculator online and it calculated mine at 2113 calories. If I understand all this stuff correctly, I should keep my daily intake right about there to stay out of "starvation mode," right? As for measurements, no I haven't done any, but I suppose I should, huh? I'll do that tonight. Thanks for taking the time to help me figure this out Rosebud. You have no idea how much it is appreciated! :bhug: