Why did your LDL go up on Low Carb?
Mods, could you sticky this one? It's asked so frequently I think it'd be worth having it readily available.
A few doctors, extremely few unfortunately, understand the problem. http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/...nking-the-myth/ Dr. Eades Quote:
Dr. Davis, a cardiologist, has written extensively about how unreliable the calculation is for people with low triglycerides. Multiple articles To sum up. If you have triglycerides under 100 the Friedewald calculation used in every "standard" cholesterol test is going to be messed up. You need to have your cholesterol directly counted, which can be done with an NMR or VAP cholesterol test. You might be able to get your doctor to order one, or you can order it yourself but they are rather pricey. So stop panicking and flush those statins down the toilet, or better yet turn them over to the hazardous waste management service in your area, and keep doing what you're doing. |
Benefits of a high-saturated fat diet on the heart
http://drbganimalpharm.blogspot.com...t-diets-in.html Quote:
Dietary fats, carbohydrate, and progression of coronary atherosclerosis in postmenopausal women. Quote:
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Here's another article on the failure of the calculated LDL test on low carbers:
When Friedewald Attacks And the cool part is it offers an alternative calculation when your triglycerides are below 100. Quote:
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Want a better reading of your LDL?
Here's a calculator that'll do a better job if your triglycerides are under 100. http://homepages.slingshot.co.nz/~geoff36/LDL_mg.htm Example for me: Total Cholesterol: 250 HDL: 66 Triglycerides: 59 Friedewald LDL: 172 New Calculation: 143 |
Along the lines of low carbing and cholesterol results, you can pay and have an expensive NMR or VAP test done and find out if you're a pattern A or pattern B or you can probably figure it out from your el cheap-o test by looking at HDL and triglycerides.
The Diet-Heart Hypothesis: Subdividing Lipoproteins From Whole Health Source (great blog by neurological doctorate student). Pattern B (for BAD!): LDL particles are small and dense. HDL is low. Triglycerides are high. Your risk of heart attack is 3x normal. Pattern A: LDL particles are large and bouyant. HDL is high. Triglycerides are low. Risk of heart attack is much less, even though your LDL might be higher (see the other articles I posted as to why the LDL is higher... it's a breakdown of the Friedewald calculation used to calculate cholesterol). So what happens when you eat low fat? Quote:
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This is terrific to know. Thank you for posting it.
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Cholesterol/LDL levels
I'm sorry to butt in on your thread but I can't find where or how to post a new thread.
I received my bloodwork back from last week and I thought with this woe that all my levels would be EXCELLENT!!!! Ok, at least better than the last time I had them checked!! :lol: Well, last July (08), I had my tests done and my cholesterol was 186, while my triglycerides were high at 167. This year my cholesterol is 211 and my tris are down to 120. HDL is good -- last year was 34, this year it's 53. But my bad cholesterol went from 119 to 134 which they recommend having the levels below 130. I'm really hoping my dr doesn't want to put me on any medication. About 3 years ago it was just over 200 and she said we'd see what the numbers looked like the following year and if they weren't down, she was going to put me on medication. Well, I was able to get them below 200 for the last couple of years...until NOW!!!! I don't believe I eat a lot of red meat and have cut way down on egg consumption. I'm just wondering if anyone else has the same problem?!?!? What can I do to get the levels back down? I know we're suppose to eat "regular" foods and not fat-free or non-fat so that's what I do. TIA for any info you can provide |
medication
"I'm really hoping my dr doesn't want to put me on any medication"
Are you not aware that you can say no? Say it with me, no,no, no!! See you can do it. Your doc will feign anger and wring her hands [she answers to the drug companies] but it is your body.BTW your numbers look fine to this layman. Enjoy some red meat and eat eggs every day if you like them, both will make you a healthier, happier person. Do some research!! be well Art |
Niacin, fish oil and more exercise can bring cholesterol down in addtition of a l/c diet usually doing it...
I've also had luck with Chinese herbs and teas.... |
For what it's worth, my cholesterol first went high in my teens the year I had an extremely low fat diet, just mainly low-calorie salads (with nonfat dressings) and veggies with a little bit of lean fish and lean meat.
Low thyroid is one thing that can cause cholesterol to go high, and to that end making sure you're not starving yourself is good. As is some reasonable exercise. |
thank you for the replies...
artp -- yes, I have every intention of NOT taking the meds...I would like to try to lower it by my own means. Cajunboy -- I have been vlc for over a year now so I was hoping my numbers would have been a lot better!!! I already take fish oil pills (errr..at least I TRY to take them every day -- they are quite a pill to swallow!! :) Anyway, my ex-husband had a bad reaction when taking niacin pills (red hot flush breakout) so I'm not too keen on the idea of taking THOSE!! I guess I rely on my multi-vitamins having enough niacin in them so taking a supplement wouldn't be necessary. I totally agree with you regarding the exercise -- I could certainly use more of that!! I was planning to swim more this summer and firm everything up but the doggone weather this summer certainly hasn't cooperated! I really need to start firming everything up -- I have so much loose skin especially on my legs. I notice it all kinda "shivers" when I walk :lol: Thanks again for the responses -- I really appreciate someone else's view! |
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We have a friend that lives in Columbus, the northeast side and she swims at a nearby indoor YMCA pool everyday, even in winter, from what she tells us, anyway.... |
Yes, I use to do that too when I belonged to the "Y". Now we have a huge pool in the backyard that I love to get in after work every day. I really hate to see the colder weather come! :( Hubby has been talking about getting a membership to the Y, so we'll just have to wait and see....
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If you read the first page or so of this thread it explains why your LDL levels go up and why it isn't anything to worry over. At least read the first page or so. I have a lot of info there that I posted so you can calculate your REAL LDL values and why you shouldn't be concerned anyway. The only thing I wonder about is why your triglycerides are still > 100. If you're being faithful to your low carb diet and not cheating, or eating a bunch of fruit/fructose, then they shouldn't be that high. Do you drink a lot? I think that might account for the high triglycerides too. |
I'm not sure, but tests have a percentage error and if your fasting is 10 hours prior to testing compared to 14 hours, it can probably have an impact on the result also, but I'm just guessing this. I had a Nurse Practioner tell me this a long time ago and didn't check it out, but I always fast 14 hours when I do blood work...
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Thanks for the info Nancy -- I'll have to read that section again. I do drink ALOT of water and coffee. Usually on the weekends, I have straight shots of tequila but don't drink sugary drinks. Don't eat much fruit...just a couple of teaspoons of crushed pineapple on my cottage cheese in the am. The only other fruits I will occasionally eat are melons and berries. I am happy that the triglycerides came down to 120 from 167 but will keep working on that!
Cajunboy -- I fasted for at least 14 - 16 hours before I had blood work done. |
well, high cholesterol doesn't really mean too much if you haven't had a heart attack from everything I read..
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http://www.reducetriglycerides.com/...ne_template.htm |
Very interesting article -- thanks Nancy!
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This blog has some interesting things on saturated fat, heart disease and cholesterol:
http://drbganimalpharm.blogspot.com/ |
Nancy, you've helped me before on this topic but I just wanted to thank you for the sticky. My Mom and I are both dealing with high total and high LDL on lowcarb (very low trigs), and with doctors who are freaking out as a result. Every couple of months I find the fear has started creeping up on me again (indoctrination is indoctrination, I guess), and realize I have started unconsciously cutting down on fats as the background fear ("my cholesterol tests are really bad!") creeps up. Being able to review this thread for a sanity check when that happens is very helpful.
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Good! Glad to hear this thread has helped! It is really hard to stand up to the so-called "experts" so having some evidence behind you really helps.
Be sure to read this: http://www.fathead-movie.com/index....from-the-heart/ Jimmy Moore has a total cholesterol count of 300 and his heart scan is flawless. |
I read today that donating blood lowers cholesterol... :)
not sure who would want mine though..... Perhaps, for those of us who are not suitable donors; "a little blood letting" now and then might be an optiion... :lol: |
My Cholesterol numbers
I had my 6 month checkup and here are my numbers if someone can help me understand i would appreciate it.
date 3/17/2009 NUmbers were total cholesterol -219 LDL-119 HDL-79 Trig-106 A1c-6.5 Date 9/04/2009 Total Cholesterol is -244 LDL-146 HDL-80 Trig-92 A1C-5.9 I know my HDL is better and my Trig and A1c is better , but why is my total cholesterol and LDL worse , i dont know if i understand all the technical stuff could somoen explain ? or give me something to read that i'll understand ? Thanks for your help , im worried , what do i need to do now. ive been on low carb for about 5 months now and lost about 34 lbs |
You are on the right path for sure.
I would keep doing what you are doing. I studied the cholesterol guidelines in my fitness school... Your doc recommends more medicine because he's following the AHA guidelines. you have two risk factors, overweight and LDL over the cutoff, and his little table says in that case, suggest statins. To his mind, your lifestyle accomplishments have not lowered the LDL number enough - some of us in LC land think that the LDL cutoff numbers have been fiddled to promote statins, but whatever, that's what the doc thinks, it looks like. It's your doc's job to suggest treatment. It's your job to decide whether you want to have that treatment. I sure wouldn't!!! LDL like yours is protective for women, and, the statin your doctor recommends has never been shown to help women, ever. Ask him to see the research where that statin helps women. Not from the drug company, but the honest to gosh research. |
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Please take a few minutes to read the first page or so of articles. They're not all super technical. If you're really concerned then spend a little time reading and getting up to speed on the issue. Most people just turn over responsibility for their health to their doctors who mismanage it. :p Your LDL is only slightly lower though, 142. Probably because your Triglycerides are still pretty close to 100. You look like you might be diabetic though with that A1C and diabetics usually have high triglycerides. Are you taking anything to treat the diabetes? Drinking booze, of any sort, also increases triglycerides. I think Vit. D3 deficiency is another thing that can too. Dr. Davis says eating wheat is another factor. But as long as your triglycerides are low (60 or less is ideal) then your LDL cholesterol will be harmless. Your HDL is also excellent, and it is very protective. In other words, the only thing you have to worry about here is lowering your triglycerides a little more and getting your blood sugar problems under better control. Your A1C is much too high. I certainly wouldn't go on statins for numbers like those, I'd work on the blood sugar, take fish oil, D3, maybe no-flush niacin if the LDL really scared me (but it shouldn't) and eliminate wheat. Dr. Davis, cardiologist, has a really great blog and a program called "Track your Plaque". http://heartscanblog.blogspot.com |
thanks Nancy , I do not drink booze and i do not eat wheat , i read that my a1c was good as long as it is under a 6.5, i do not take meds for my diabetes. but it runs strong in my family bot grandmothers and a few uncles and aunts so i know that something i have to be careful about and the reason i choose low carb , aside from the fact that i like this woe , i will do my research , thank you for your time and advice
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Most doctors vastly under treat diabetes.
An A1C of 6.5 is NOT good. That means your average BG is around 154, which is well over the point where you start acquiring diabetes related damage to your organs, nerves, heart, kidneys, eyes and everything else. 140 is the point damage starts to happen. 5.9 is a little better but you're still very close to the 140 mark. If I were you, I'd look for a doctor willing to treat the diabetes more aggressively. Maybe go on Metformin until you lose more weight and the BG comes down. Or you can hold your current course and keep a close eye on the A1c, if it doesn't come down below 5.5, definitely find some medical help, IMHO. But your high blood sugar is going to do more to ruin your health than your cholesterol. |
I have been thinking about a new doc alot lately anyway , so i will keep that in mind , i so appreciate your help on understanding how this stuff works
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Have a question. Just got back blood test results. Dr. wanted them because I had a low vitamin D number of 24. So I got the results and it went up to 31. Funny because I never even took the vitamin D3 2000 units she recommended yet. I am though now. But the nurse said she needed to tell me bad news about my cholesterol. Well in the past it was total: lower than 200, LDL around 118, Try: around 50, and the HDL was about 38. So I changed and got into an exercise program with a team fitness group and work out M,W,F for an hour.
Today was with my recollection: Total: 223 LDL: 158 try 50 HDL: 55 Ratio: 2.9 I was so proud of the HDL I worked so hard for but the nurse on the phone asked if I wanted info on a low cholesterol diet. NOPE. Thanks. She didn't offer me statins because I said I will never take them. My only question is: Could it be that my LDL went up because my HDL went up? My trainer at the gym said that if my HDL goes up my LDL should go down. I am pretty low carb but not strict Atkins anymore. I do LC. Anyone have any answers to that one? Also, no diabetes, no drinking, no smoking, no caffeine. But both parents with high blood pressure and high cholesterol both on statins and one had 3 strokes in early 60s. Only big reason that worried. I am 40 and with the last 6 months of working out, feel younger and better than when I started this diet last year. Thanks LCers Lisa |
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