Kim -- thanks for the recipes :)

Sh'ra -- I understand the "rebellion" thing. It's so childish, and I've done it so often. Sometimes it's when I haven't lost -- gettinga back at Whoever -- but sometimes it's when I have. There's no logical reason for it, but powerful emotional ones. What is it in us that says "I want to be thin but I want to eat anything I want any time I want it?" Where did that COME from? (I don't think it's inborn!)

Victoria -- glad you're staying strong. Congratulations!

I had an easy, pleasant holiday -- no temptations, and I needed that this year. I have to go out to dinner tomorrow night with an old friend, and I cannot tell him that I'm on another diet. I just can't. So I'll have to be subtly good. As long as I can stear us away from Chinese or Italian, I should be ok. I may not be able to stick to Thin4G, but I'll stick to low carb.

I have had another scale crisis, though -- I think my current one is under-weighing me. I posted the story in my journal. I won't be sure how much until tomorrow morning, but I may have to change my start and current stats again.

A better new year next year to everyone :)

CAD-I'm going to try it
 

Hi guys,
Hope everyone made it through Chrissy okay. :)

Recently I decided to read the Carbohydrate's Addict's Diet Book.
I was curious but extremely cynical. :rolleyes:
Well, I read it ...and....I'm going to try it for the rest of my school holidays (that is until the end of January 2002). If I have not lost any weight or have put on weight by then I will go back on Atkin's. :thup:
If I have lost weight and feel well, I'll continue with CAD.
So I'll keep you posted how I am going and obviously my Journal will reflect some BIG changes, especially those Reward meals.
Hmmm...I'm still sceptical but I will stick with the diet to trial it properly.
Has anyone in this club had any experience with CAD ??
I'm open to negative and positive experiences/ advice/ sugestions/ support/ warnings.

K-Louise, sorry about that 'thumbs-down' symbol at the beginning of my welcoming statement to you...it was meant to be near my comment about the HOT weather!!
I hope that you are not near any of those dangerous fires in NSW and that if you are you and your loved ones are safe.

See ya ,
kezza :wave:

CAD
 

I tried this for a little while before starting on Atkins, and it didn't work for me, but I know others it has. I think my problem was that i used the reward hour for a total binge, not the idea, and the no snacking between meals was hard for me too. I like to have somthing every 2-3 hours (even if its small). Let me know how you go with it, I'd be interested.

The bushfires are not near me (I'm on the coast), but the smell of smoke in the air is awful - it woke me up this morning. The air is thick and hazy. It really is devastating, 100 fires over 2/3 of New South Wales. It will take a lot to get the wildlife back when the vegetation regrows.

Take care
Kim

I spoke too soon!
 

What is it? Pride goeth before a fall? I spoke too soon. It seems that as soon as I wrote to you guys that I was staying strong, I messed up big time. I ate fudge!!! Ugh! So today is another day...lots of water and careful food planning. But you had better believe I sent the rest of the fudge to work with my husband! He is very thin and doesn't have a weight problem at all. Infact he has trouble keeping enough weight on.

The kids are almost done with the chocolate, thank God! So life is getting back to normal. My Mom is leaving and traveling back to Texas. I will miss her, but have had such a wonderful time visiting with her. Well, anyway....thank you all for your support. You are all great! :daze: Victoria

Victoria,
I'm not used to the over-sweet stuff anymore, either. Guess I can say that's a good thing :) Today, I brought in honey coated macadamias and chocolate covered nuts that also came our way for the holidays *sigh* Why did they mess up perfectly good macadamias with that??? Oy! But, better on my office mates' hips than mine :D

Alto,
Yep, it is childish. I suppose it is as what the Apostle Sha'ul (Paul) said, when he stated (paraphrased) "Those things I want to do I don't do, and those things I don't want to do, I do!" Apparently he struggled with that rebellion as well. We WANT to lose weight. We don't WANT to eat the wrong things - but we do it anyway, out of emotional excuses or just plain rebellion. I know part of my "rebellion" was that I was very tense at my parents' home. I love them a lot, but they are the type of people that it is hard to be around for any length of time without feeling like you're reverting back to being a child and wanting to run away :)


Kezza,
I did CAD before I ever thought to try Atkins. At the time, I felt Atkins was too restrictive, and I wanted that reward meal. Like K-LOUISE, though, I used the reward meal as an excuse to binge. I knew that you were supposed to do a salad, then 1/3 of vegis, 1/3 of carbs, and 1/3 of protein; and then keep matching it if you got seconds - and finish everything in 60 minutes. Well, you'd be amazed at how much you can eat in 60 minutes, and how much salad you can shove in if it means a little more carbs. Because I am a "true" carb addict, it just seemed to make me crave more, so I was not very successful doing it.

However, I have known many people who have done very well on CAD, so take heart. As long as you don't use it as an excuse to binge, you'll be fine.

K-Louise and Kezza,
I'm sorry to hear about the fires. I hadn't even heard about them here in MO (so much news about the terrorists and Afghanistan, there isn't much covered on the rest of the world *sigh*). I hope that the fires are gotten under control soon. It's always devastating when so much is burned - looks like a wasteland for years; but then, it does come back after a few, and greener than before. I'm going to look online with the news services so I can read up.

Shalom, all,
Sh'ra

Hey, Victoria, clean out your private mailbox, willya? I can't send anything to ya :D

Hi everyone. Glad everyone made it through Christmas in more or less one piece.

My scale was off by eight pounds. I changed both start and now rates -- I did NOT gain eight pounds this week!!!!! :)

Kezza, I tried CAD for about two days. It didn't work for me, because I never had any trouble not eating carbs at dinner. It's breakfast and lunch where I needed the carb indulgence (cereal and sandwich and fruit) and doing the Reward meal for lunch didn't work.

But as others have said, I've known others who did lose on CAD, and I hope it works for you.

Kim and Kezza, I hadn't heard about the brush fires either. Our news is HORRIBLE on international coverage. We have similar spats of fires, especially on our West Coast, and when they're burning, it seems as though the world will burn -- 1000 acres, 2000 acres. How can there be any forest left? But the forests seem to come back within just a year or two. Nature is much more amazing than anything man has done!

Victoria, you did very well, I think, if you only got into the fudge once -- and got rid of it immediately.

Sh'ra, I think you made the connection -- maybe this is another habit or learned behavior problem, but sort of at one remove. You weren't rebelling at the WOE, but at your parents, and doing it through the WOE, because as children the one thing we can do to drive our parens crazy is A) make noise and B) mess with food!!

Have a great day everyone.

Alto,
You are too kind! But I don't feel that way. I have to try not to be too hard on myself---but I have to be hard on myself to keep going. If that makes sense? I just don't want to take it lightly and shrug it off. I have to make sure that the temptation is gone, because there is always times in the day where I am weaker. Why is that? One moment you can turn down very tempting things, and the next moment the strength is gone. It all starts in the head I think. But this morning I ate some cottage cheese and mexican cheese. VERY filling and light on the carbs. I think today it is important to eat very low carb and very satisfying foods to keep the desire for something BAD down.

But I appreciate your encouraging words Alto. Sometimes when I read people's journals and they are so...strict with themselves....it makes me squirmy. Like going to someone's house that is SO CLEAN that you don't feel comfortable enough to sit down. I don't know if that makes sense to anyone else at all. But it is good to know that people do make mistakes, so that we know we are NOT alone in this. It is one day at a time!!! Love you guys! :rheart: Victoria
P.S. Alto--I know it must be hard to realize that your scale has been untruthful with you. But the truth will set you free! It's good to know where you are really at---for the long haul. Ten pounds down the line, you won't even remember this episode. At least now you know where you truly started from. And when you get to your goal, it will be even more of a victory!

I'm sticking to my untruthful scale - as long as it's going down, I don't wanna know if it's lower than others :) I'll get an accurate one when I get closer to my goal weight. Don't think I could stand going back up - Alto, you have a will of steel, my dear.

Victoria,
Amen on your post. I have to be strict with myself and don't want to have a lassaiz faire attitude about this, but I also don't want to be so rigid that I fail and binge due to denying myself too much or too quickly. And each time I "cheat" is a learning experience for me - I learn what my triggers are, and that it's not as good as I expected it to be. Those are some good lessons :)

Sh'ra

Learning lesson
 

Yes Sh'ra, I like that. It is a learning lesson. I want to learn the lesson and not to ignore it or deny it. Yes, failure and shame will lead to binging with me. So when I fail, I have to take it very seriously and make good food decisions right away so it becomes a "past" thing and not a continuing failure. So I could use some prayer if any of you think of me today. Thank you. ;) I think this is the first time in my life where I feel I have the answers to this compulsion for food. So as long as I eat lots of the right types of food, I will stay away from the wrong ones. But I'm sure it could have to do with emotional stresses also. Well, anyway....every day is a new day...Thank God! :p Victoria

Victoria,
Will be praying throughout the day, sis. I know how you feel - it is so tempting to eat when those trigger emotions crop up, because that is one place we have gone to for comfort before - and comfort foods tend to be high carb foods. There's chemical reason for that, too, ya know.

Carbs raise blood sugar levels (for a time), and some complex carbohydrates will even raise serotonin levels (that lovely chemical that gives us a sense of well-being) for a time; that is why when we are stressed and/or depressed, we automatically want to turn to carbs - they actually DO make you have a very temporary sense of "I really do feel better." However, the problem is that they are temporary, and the blood sugar, serotonin, and beta endorphin (another feel-good brain chemical) drop quickly, and you're back searching for more carbs to raise them back up again.

The good thing is that the longer we LC, the more all three of these chemicals will regulate themselves, so there won't be spikes (emotional highs) followed by extreme lows....mood swings, anyone? I'd been interested one day to do a survey of the people on this board and see just how many suffered from mood swings before turning to LC.

Shalom,
Sh'ra

Hi everyone,
I just heard on the news tonight that the fires in New South Wales, around Syney are raging on a 600km front! Imagine a fire stretching in a line that long. (obviously there are some gaps and it is not in a straight line). Anyway no property was burnt today so that is good. I'm pleased to hear you are safe, K-louise. :)

Thanks for all the comments about CAD. It is great to know I can come here are ask questions and seek advice without being 'told off' or made to feel silly. I suppose we have all had enough of that in our lives!! :rolleyes:

Well...after writing my last reply here about swapping over to CAD from Atkins, I thought I would see if there was some more info on this site about CAD and there was!!! YAY! :)

I read some great advice about CAD being abit outdated and I needed to read the CALP version (Carbohydrate Addict's Lifespan Program). So this morning I got hold of that and have made the necessary adjustments.

So...so far I have had one day on CAD and one day on CALP and am going fine. I have'nt put on weight, which is good. I'll weight myself everyday at the same time and average the weight over a week before I post any losses.
i'm not feeling hungry, probably because I am having bacon and eggs for breakfast. (I learnt that on Atkins...if I had a high protein breakfast I would make it through to lunch just fine).

The Reward meals have been interesting. Tonight I did it properly and there was no way I could fit any more food within the hour specified for eating. I only ate a normal serving sizes and I had to rush to fit my dessert in. At this early stage I don't feel like binging . When I go shopping and walk past carb- based food I usually would LOVE to eat, and now can, I don't really want to buy it and eat it during my reward meal...Strange. Maybe some of my cravings were more just desiring to have something forbidden.
Okay, enough of my ravings!!! The proof will be in the weightloss.
I'll keep you all posted.
I hope everyone else is going fine.
see ya
kezza :wave:

Keep us posted
 

Kezza,
I am interested in the differences between the CAD and CALP. I guess I could look for the book. But I'm interested in how it goes with you...keep us posted. Will be looking for your successes! ;)

I'm sorry to hear about the fires in your country. I live in California and we have forest fires in the summer and early fall quite frequently. Now that it has gotten colder and wetter, it's not a problem anymore. But my Aunt had a close call this fall--their home was spared (thank God), but they did have to be evacuated. It is frightening! Hope you all are OK. :) Victoria

Differences between CAD and CALP ( I think)
 

Victoria, I have tried to outline below the main differences between CAD and CALP.
Both diets are by Dr Rachael and Dr Richard Heller.

They wrote the Carbohydrate Addict's Diet (CAD) first. (My copy of the book was published in 1993)
The main principles are;
1.Eat Complementary Meals Daily
-That is high fibre, low fat and low carbo meals

2. eat a Reward Meal Every Day
-any food you desire, any quantity, as long as the meal is nourishing and well balanced

3.Complete your Reward Meal within one hour
-By finishing the meal within the hour you are trying to avoid a second release of insulin .
The first release of insulin when you started the Reward Meal should be low because you only ate low carb meals all day.

4. All alcohol to be consumed during Reward Meal

5. Absolutely No Between-Meal Snacking is Allowed

After two weeks on the Entry Diet of 2 low carb meals and one Reward Meal a day then there are guidelines to follow about adding low carb snacks and extra salads with the Reward Meal.

The Carbohydrate Addict's lifespan program (CALP) is more current. (My copy of the book was published in 1998).

The main principles are;
1. eat a balanced Reward Meal every day
-a bowl of salad needs to be consumed first
-you can eat whatever you want BUT you must eat 1/3 LC protein,
1/3 LC vegetables and 1/3 carbos (this includes your dessert)
- you can eat more serves if you want but it must be in the 1/3,1/3, 1/3 portions.
-alcohol and extra coffee with milk, softdrinks etc must all be consumed only with Reward meal.

2. Complete Your Reward Meal within the One Hour - MUST NOT go past this hour guideline or more insulin is produced

3. Eat only Craving -Reducing (LC) foods at all other meals and Snacks.
After 2 weeks on the BASIC PLAN using the above guidelines, you can chose from lots of Options to encourage / maintain weightloss. The Options are to do with exercise, supplements and artificial sweetners, etc.

Soooooo......I think the main difference is that the CALP diet forces you to eat alot of salad and veges with any carbs you consume at the Reward Meal. This makes it difficult to binge because you have to eat vast quanties of protein/ veges to keep everything in proportion. :daze: :daze:
In my very short experience with the diet (3 days) I have found that even though I am eating carbs at my Reward Meal I don't want to go overboard. I can barely get all the food eaten within the hour- I have to rush to get dessert and a coffee in. :D

I won't go into all the lists of what you can eat for the Complementary meals, but basically the food is low carb and low fat. But there is no weighing and measuring and if you are hungry you can really fill up on salad and protein. :thup:

I won't even try to explain how it all works chemically but just as Atkins is after a particular chemical reaction in the body (ketosis), CAD and CALP are focusing on insulin production.

If anyone wants to follow CAD or CALP please don't follow what I have written here. Get the books from the library and read up on all the stuff I could'nt write. :idea:

Enough about CALP.
I hope that everyone is doing fine.
See ya
kezza :wave:

I've finally read something about the Australian fires, Kezza -- and they believe it was arson! That is all the more horrible, of course.

I'd read both CAD and CALP when they first came out, and I think this was another plan that at first didn't take into account the capacity for some people to binge. There were articles about CAD, of people who did not lose, because they took the "eat anything you want for an hour" to mean cake, cookies, ice cream. I think your question about wanting something forbidden is a good one. I don't think there's good research on this -- or more properly, I don't know of any. Some people really truly are addicted to carbs. One taste and they're gone. They're like alcoholics who'll drink cooking sherry and rubbing alcohol. They NEED it. And there are people who have food-mood habits, or just plain habits. And there are people who eat huge quantities of food, or just normal quantities of the wrong foods, constantly :) It seems common sense to me that there should be a different approach for each type (and there may well be more types). Telling the carb addict s/he's "bad" for wanting cookies or "just stop eating so much" creates shame where none should be and doesn't help the problem.

Anyway :) (forgive diversion) I think CALP, and Protein Power both realized by their second books that portion guidance was necessary. Even Atkins, as I remember the 1970s version, was "eat all you want! Drown yourself in cream, munch on cheese all day, slather butter on your steak" and that language isn't in the newer books.

Have a good weekend, everyone :)

By the way, I was thinking of starting a new thread for January (and doing so every month, if the threads were fairly long). What do you all think of that? I don't think it matters to the forum -- there are some very long threads here, and they work fine. To me, it gets confusing when a thread is very long, and perhaps discouraging to new people to join in because they think they have to read 10 pages of posts. But some people like very long threads for the sense of continuity. What do you all think?