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-   -   5 week stall on induction! (http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=141885)

becky160 Fri, Oct-17-03 08:16



Total: 1603 YOU DID IT!!!!
Fat: 123 1104 70% PERFECT!!!
Sat: 37 332 21%
Poly: 23 211 13%
Mono: 52 468 30%
Carbs: 26 83 5% PERFECT!!!!
Fiber: 5 0 0%
Protein: 97 387 25% PERFECT!!!!

Check this link. Here you will be able to find out what is your LBM. http://www.urplace.com/LifeTools/BMR.aspx


I'll come ans check your Today's stats (Friday)

halo_slips Fri, Oct-17-03 22:19

Thanks Becky! That was wonderful! As I suspected, I ate too much protein on Friday. But I'm on the right track now I think.
Calories Eaten Today
source grams cals %total
Total: 1744
Fat: 133 1198 69%
Sat: 54 485 28%
Poly: 18 158 9%
Mono: 50 453 26%
Carbs: 20 63 4%
Fiber: 4 0 0%
Protein: 116 465 27%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%

becky160 Fri, Oct-17-03 22:45

Greeeaaat!!!!
 
Calories Eaten Today
source grams cals %total
Total: 1744 Amazing!!!!
Fat: 133 1198 69% Awsome!!!!
Sat: 54 485 28%
Poly: 18 158 9%
Mono: 50 453 26%
Carbs: 20 63 4% Fantastic!!!!
Fiber: 4 0 0% Need to work on that...More veggies.
Protein: 116 465 27% Very good!!!!
Alcohol: 0 0 0%

You are a pretty fast learner. C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S !!!!

Now, after a week of checking your stats, and watching closely what you eat, have you lost any weight?

How do you feel?

Are you drinking enough water?

Now is time to check what you were doing wrong, and what you have corrected.

Let me know, ok.

halo_slips Sun, Oct-19-03 00:18

Hey Becky!!
Yes I've lost between 2 and 2.5 kilos this week! Thanks for all your help! I'm not sure what I was doing wrong- maybe it was too much cheese (I've cut back on that). I no longer use artificial sweetener (well, maybe occasionally), and am eating more fat. I think my body just took a while to adjust to this woe too. But I don't expect progress like that every week. I'll probably have a slow week now, but that's ok. I can deal. Now that I know it will happen eventually, I can wait it out!
Thank you sooo much!!!
HJ

becky160 Sun, Oct-19-03 20:39

Great!
 
I'm really happy to hear that you are back on track. i whish you lots and lots of luck in your LC WOE and WOL.
In case you have any questions, please stop by my journal or PM me.
It was a pleasure helping you out. I did it with all my heart and Caring.
If for some reason you feel that I have missinformed you, please let me know.

:yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay: :yay:

newmee Mon, Oct-20-03 15:02

Hi Becky160

Do you think you would be able to help one more person out of a bad stall? I have discovered on my own that all of my tea drinking was doing alot of carb hogging as it is labled 1 carb/cup so I have bought a new brand that has none. I have not lost anything in over a month now (since my initial induction) and could use any advice you would be willing to provide me.

becky160 Mon, Oct-20-03 16:33

Hi Newmee!
 
Hi Newmee! :wave:

It will be a pleasure helping you out. I do not do any miracles...I can guide you and give you advice.
I have noticed that you are pretty close to your goal weight...At that point, your weigth loss is pretty slow. Please be patient.

To begin with let me ask you a couple of questions:

How do you keep track of your food intake?
Do you have a fitday account? www.fitday.com
How much do you exercise a week?
How much water do you drink?
Since when have you been stalled?
Are you keeping track of your measurements? www.mybodycomp.com

Please answer all of this questions...and then we will check what have you been doing wrong. In the meanwhile, I suggest you read thru this thread. You will find very valuable information to get you started.

See ya soon! :yay: :yay:

Rosebud Mon, Oct-20-03 16:38

Quote:
Originally Posted by newmee
Hi Becky160

Do you think you would be able to help one more person out of a bad stall? I have discovered on my own that all of my tea drinking was doing alot of carb hogging as it is labled 1 carb/cup so I have bought a new brand that has none. I have not lost anything in over a month now (since my initial induction) and could use any advice you would be willing to provide me.

Hi there Newmee,

Okay, I'm not Becky, but I believe I may be able to help you. :)

I've just peeked into your journal where you admit you have been binging a little since Thanksgiving. (Please don't feel too guilty about that. Carbs exert a powerful addiction.)

My point is that you can't say you are stalled unless you have been keeping to your plan. ;)

So, I believe that once you are back on plan, you may well find that you will lose again.

Meanwhile, have a look at the advice here about plateaus: http://www.lowcarbretreat.com/plateaus.html

I hope your weight loss resumes soon. :there:

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

newmee Tue, Oct-21-03 09:25

Thank you Becky and Rosebud. It is true that I was "binging" for 1 week. I was stalled for 4 weeks prior to that...And well...Got very discouraged.

I am using Fit Day. When I don't have time for the computer I write down what I have eaten in my journal I keep at home.(A typical day for me is around 1000 cals, 70% Fat, carbs 12-18, protein 37.
I exercise for 40 mins 3 times a week.(as well as chasing my 2 year old son around daily).
I drink 120 Ounces of water per day.
Was stalled for 4 weeks prior to ThanksGiving(1 week ago)
I am keeping track of my inches lost on paper at home. I have seen no change for about 3 weeks now.

I will be reading all of the threads...and using the advice given.

Thanx.

becky160 Tue, Oct-21-03 10:44

Hi Newmee
 
After seeing what you posted I think that:

1.-Your water intake is fine but did you know tht High Protein intake can cause dehydration? I would recommend you drink water until you see that your urine has come out clear at least 5 times.. Water intake during induction is very important due to the production of ketones and the fat that need too be drained out of the body as well as other toxines. keep a bottle of water with you all the time. As soon as you see that the bottle is empty, please refill it.

2..- The human body works with energy to function ans this energy comes mostly from the foods eaten and the calories they provide to your body. there is an amount of calories the body needs for the required body's energy to meet the basic functions: blood flow, respiration, heartbeat, brain function, regulation of body temperature, nerve impulses, etc. . This is called "Basal Metabolism". I have read that energy required each day by the body averages 70% of calories.

When calorie intake is restricted to levels below the Basal Metabolism, it slows in order to conserve it's energy stores for an emergency. This is often referred to as "starvation mode" because the body is convinced it is starving and enters into a metabolic state that will conserve energy to allow survival for extended periods without sufficient calorie intake. Entering into starvation mode does not happen overnight, it takes some period of time - I have read that typically one week to one month, depending on how severely restricted calories are. The more calories are restricted, the faster the body will seek survival and enter into metabolic conservation of energy.

A person's Basal Metabolism is completely individual. It is based on a number of factors that include age, gender, height, and weight. It is for this reason there is no standard guideline to use for everyone - Basal Metabolism must be calculated for the individual, not an age group, gender group or height group alone.

I suggest you ckeck online Metabolic Rate Calculators, to find out which could be your MINIMUM calorie intake.

3.-Are you taking into consideration NET CARBS or TOTAL CARBS?

Quote:
In most cases, the fiber will not interfere with weight loss because it does not impact upon blood sugar levels. In fact, what used to be called Net Atkins Carbs, we now simply call Net Carbs or “the only carbs that you need to count when you do Atkins” are calculated by subtracting the number of grams of fiber from the total carb count.


How much Fiber?

Quote:
The Induction phase of Atkins does not quite meet the United States Department of Agriculture requirements for intake of fiber, which is 25 to 35 grams daily. This can easily be met by supplementing your diet with a tablespoon or more of wheat bran, psyllium husks or flax meal. Once you add more vegetables, berries, seeds and nuts back into your diet, you will be consuming plenty of fiber.
Source: the Atkins Center.

Please take a look at the list for recommended Induction Phase vegetables, in www.atkins.com.
.
4.- There are certain oils, like Olive oil, canola, walnut, soybean, grapeseed, sesame, sunflower and safflower oils, which are very very nutritional and recommended by Atkins. Butter and Mayo are allowed and I suggest you completely avoid MARGARINE.


5.-LAST NOTE: according to the ATKINS CENTER your percentages during induction should be the following.

Protein: between 25 - 30%
Fat: Between 65% - 70%
Carbs: 20 grams of Carbohydrates.
Fiber : 3 cups of recommended Atkins Vegetables, preferably HIGH IN FIBER.


I really recommend you start Using Fitday as a Daily tool. It will really help you out to keep track of your food intake, it will give you your food intake percentages, and it has the activities log and great reports!

Good Luck to you.

For any further comments or questions, Please PM me. See you!! :wiggle:

The information stated by me is not that one of a Doctor. I'm giving this advice due to personal experience, reading and other people's recommendations.

Kristine Tue, Oct-21-03 10:56

Becky, with all due respect, there is no reason for a 120 lb person to drink more than 120 oz water per day. 90 g or so of protein for an active woman isn't "high" protein. Drinking until your urine is constantly clear is going a little overboard. Pale urine that registers pale pink on ketosticks is perfectly fine.

newmee, metabolic calculators aren't a bad idea, but they aren't too accurate because they don't take into account dieting history, medications, and other factors that can accel or slow metabolism. A good guess-timate is 10-12 x your body weight. Go for the 12 since you're active. :thup:

becky160 Tue, Oct-21-03 17:41

Hi Kristine, :wave: Thank you for your reply but I think there is a missundestanding here.

Let me post:

Quote:
Your water intake is fine but did you know that High Protein intake can cause dehydration? I would recommend you drink water until you see that your urine has come out clear at least 5 times...


Now lets compare information:

Quote:
there is no reason for a 120 lb person to drink more than 120 oz water per day. 90 g or so of protein for an active woman isn't "high" protein.[/COLOR] Drinking until your urine is constantly clear is going a little overboard. Pale urine that registers pale pink on ketosticks is perfectly fine.


I did not specify the quantity of water she should drink. I said it was fine. and that I recommended her to drink it until it comes out clear.

Researchers at the University of Connecticut recently studied the effects of such diets on hydration. 5 very fit endurance runners consumed low, medium and high-protein diets over 3 consequetive 4-week periods. During the high protein periods the participants consumed about 30% of their total calories from high protein foods such as eggs, steak and 'power bars'.

Blood tests conducted on the runners revealed that the high-protein intake reduced levels of hydration and that a greater strain was placed upon the kidneys.

Worryingly, the runners said they felt no more thirsty while on the high protein diet compared to the other regimes even though their levels of hydration had fallen to below healthy levels. It may therefore be possible for dehydration to go unnoticed while following such a diet.

Prudence suggests that fluid intake should automatically be increased if one is to embark upon this type of diet. However, the diet will still place additional demand upon the kidneys.

Source of information: http://www.yournutrition.co.uk/news...hydration_m.htm

Where did I mention that 90g of protein was high? Where did she post tht she had 90 gms of protein? I have seen 37gms, pretty low considering that the minimum protein intake for a woman is 60 gms of protein.

"Pale urine that registers pale pink on ketosticks is perfectly fine."
1 have to say that I drink near 2 gallons of water a day, and that my ketostix are always purple, measuring ketones at any time of the day. Could you please post your source of information so we can make a comparison? Could I have a health problem?

newmee, metabolic calculators aren't a bad idea, but they aren't too accurate because they don't take into account dieting history, medications, and other factors that can accel or slow metabolism. A good guess-timate is 10-12 x your body weight. Go for the 12 since you're active.

Ok, lets make some numbers here:

10 x 125 = 1025 calories
12 x 125 = 1500 calories ( Don't you think that for an active person 1500 calories is fine?)

Could you please post your source of information on getting this BMR?
I want to learn more. I love learning.

Thank you Kristine, please reply. :wiggle: :wiggle: :wiggle: :wiggle:

Kristine Wed, Oct-22-03 18:10

>>"Where did I mention that 90g of protein was high?"

Right here: "...but did you know tht High Protein intake can cause dehydration?" Atkins and similar plans are adequate in protein, not high.

>>"Where did she post tht she had 90 gms of protein? I have seen 37gms, pretty low considering that the minimum protein intake for a woman is 60 gms of protein."

Read it again. It's percentages. My math was rough, but I gathered about 90 g.

>>"1 have to say that I drink near 2 gallons of water a day, and that my ketostix are always purple, measuring ketones at any time of the day. Could you please post your source of information so we can make a comparison? "

I don't know what you're referring to here, but again, there's no particular reason to aim for clear urine. That study was conducted on only five people, and they were endurance runners. No recommended quantities of water were established.

becky160 Wed, Oct-22-03 21:52

Kristine,

Thank you for replying. Once again lets see, and please don't feel offended. We are trying to get things figured out.

Becky : "Where did I mention that 90g of protein was high?"

Kristine: Right here: "...but did you know tht High Protein intake can cause dehydration?"

I did not Say "90 grams of Protein intake is considered HIGH" or "You are having a High protein intake..." Did I?

Becky: "Where did she post that she had 90 gms of protein? I have seen 37gms, pretty low considering that the minimum protein intake for a woman is 60 gms of protein."

Kristine: Read it again. It's percentages. My math was rough, but I gathered about 90 g.

I did read it again as you ordered and you are right...I missed the % sign which was not posted and missed something there.."Percentages”

Kristine: Atkins and similar plans are adequate in protein, not high.

Let’s see what others say about what is adequate and what is High Protein intake:

"For adults, adequate protein intake is defined as the minimal amount needed to maintain nitrogen balance.
In adults the recommended intake is 0.8-1.0 g protein/kg body weight per day..."

"Women with high protein intake were defined as those in the top 20% of protein consumption" http://www.nelh.nhs.uk/hth/kidneys.asp

"Total protein intake should not be excessive — 50 to 100g a day — and should make up no more than about 15% of calories" http://www.biomedcentral.com/news/20011015/03/

"The AHA is now warning against such diets, in which protein typically makes up to 20 to 30% or more of total energy intake ....."
http://www.biomedcentral.com/news/20011015/03/

"Any amount exceeding 25% of total caloric intake would be considered high." http://www.24hourfitness.com/html/t...rition/protein/

So now, please tell me, which is the percentage of protein intake during induction phase?


About water intake:

Kristine: I don't know what you're referring to here, but again, there's no particular reason to aim for clear urine. That study was conducted on only five people, and they were endurance runners. No recommended quantities of water were established.

I re-estate that High Protein intake can cause dehydration being a Moderate, Athlete or an Active person. And I still recommend to drink more water than the recommended daily amount until the urine comes out clear, and if the person is still thirsty.

Kristine: Drinking until your urine is constantly clear is going a little overboard.

I NEVER mentioned CONSTANTLY.

Pale urine that registers pale pink on ketosticks is perfectly fine.


This was my post:

1 have to say that I drink near 2 gallons of water a day, and that my ketostix are always purple, measuring ketones at any time of the day. Could you please post your source of information so we can make a comparison? Could I have a health problem?
Does this mean that I need to drink more than 2 gallons of water a day?


Thank you Kristine. I'm sorry if my english is not too good. Is just that I speak 4 lenguages fluently, and is hard to know one as "Native" but mine. I will do my best on learning to express myself much better, and most of all read everything 10 times before posting. But please, don't feel offended...No offence, Kristine. I'm just learning, just the way you did and still do to give good advice.

By the way, I am not PM'ing with Halo_slips or Lonnie, if you are concerned.

Lisa N Thu, Oct-23-03 15:51

Quote:
Let’s see what others say about what is adequate and what is High Protein intake:

"For adults, adequate protein intake is defined as the minimal amount needed to maintain nitrogen balance.
In adults the recommended intake is 0.8-1.0 g protein/kg body weight per day..."

"Women with high protein intake were defined as those in the top 20% of protein consumption" http://www.nelh.nhs.uk/hth/kidneys.asp

"Total protein intake should not be excessive — 50 to 100g a day — and should make up no more than about 15% of calories" http://www.biomedcentral.com/news/20011015/03/

"The AHA is now warning against such diets, in which protein typically makes up to 20 to 30% or more of total energy intake ....."
http://www.biomedcentral.com/news/20011015/03/

"Any amount exceeding 25% of total caloric intake would be considered high." http://www.24hourfitness.com/html/t...rition/protein/



Ummm...Becky...you do realize that nearly every one of the sites that you posted are promoting a high carb lifestyle, right? If 50-60% of your calories are supposed to come from carbs and another 20-30% from fats, that doesn't leave a lot of room for protein, does it? Also, nearly every one of those links is an opinion piece and no studies were quoted in most of them.
Let's go over them one by one.
In the first link, they state that "women with high protein intake were defined as those in the top 20% of protein consumption". Since they don't tell us how much this is, it's pretty useless.
In the second link, they are pushing a high carb (55% of daily calories) lifestyle, so of course they are not going to recommend that you eat a lot of protein (protein also contains fats which they are also afraid of). I'd also like to point out that Susan Jebb is getting her funding from the Flour industry...think she's going to bite the hand that feeds her? They also don't quote any studies to back up their position.
The third link is from the same article. Again, no references on what they are basing their recommendations on except current dietary dogma from the same folks that recommend we eat lots of grains and follow the food pyramid.
The last link is another opinion piece, again with no references to what they base their recommendation on.


As for the effect of protein on kidneys, here are a few additional studies:

http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/1/11-42747.html
http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/1/11-492942.html
http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/1/11-492942.html

And regarding calculating minimum protein requirements:
http://www.eatprotein.com/answers1.htm#1c


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